Wulf Moon's SUPER SECRETS Workshop & Challenge!

Retro, no worries, I only found out WotF existed in June of this year I appreciate the nudge in the right direction. Once I finish writing this one, I'll see if I can find someone I can wrangle into reading both.

EDIT: If you're just between past and present tense, I feel like you should do what sounds better. Sorry, I initially interpreted the dilemma as first person present vs third person past. Previous comments still apply, sort of...

It's better if you can explain why it's better. Is there an objective reason yours works better in first person, or does your writing just sound better? If your story would be best told (by a seasoned pro, let's say) in first person, then that's what you should do.

I would submit whichever you feel is your best, or if you're conflicted... play submission roulette and alternate sending each one to another pro market. Whatever kraken is waiting on Dec 31 goes to WotF!

I personally like first person, and my favorite books are written that way (Moon recently mentioned Gene Wolfe - he often wrote unreliable narrators, which can only be first person). A child's perspective makes more sense in first person (like Moon's story). That being said, third person has advantages in most situations: freedom to telescope in and out, ability to change viewpoints (for a longer work), etc.

I struggled last quarter when I learned of the judges' preferences. Since I was on the fence, I decided on third person and rewrote my first draft. There were pros both ways, but not enough to justify the risk. That being said, a flash I submitted recently had to be first person present; it wouldn't work in third person.

In the end, I improved my story by being forced into third person. I had to minimize my regret by finding creative ways to better the story. Plus, reinforcing the POV character's name without clunky dialogue improved the intro.

I'm no pro, but happy to take a look. PM me.

To Leah's (SwiftPotato's) question, there is only one answer:

Write the story you set out to write, in the voice it came to you in, and stop worrying about everyone else, even the judges. Do not change it to please anyone else, even the judges. So all three at the workshop said they don't like first person--it didn't stop them from voting to put stories written in first person in the anthology. I know my story would have been weakened in third person. I wrote it the only way it could have been written to evoke the most emotion from the tale. You know the story you wanted to tell, and you changed it to please others, and now it's not working. Go back and tell the story you originally set out to tell and shut off those outside voices. They don't belong in your head when you're writing.

A word to the wise. While it's good to know rules and current trends and judges' and editors' preferences, you also have to stay true to yourself, and true to the story you set out to tell. When we are new, that's harder, because we haven't solidified our style and voice yet. We aren't quite sure if we're doing it right.

If it's flowing, you're doing it right. Don't stop. Finish the story. Go write your next. The more you get in the saddle and ride, the more comfortable you will become, the more confident you will become. You'll find your path.

Officer, I see what you mean. I think I'm just newb enough that I haven't gotten confident enough to say I know this story works best in this perspective, and here's why. You make a really good point, and I think I need to go do some research on which POVs work best for which situations so I can back my instincts up. I appreciate the offer - I have intros written both ways, so I'll shoot you a PM at some point!

Moon, thanks for the advice here. I was asking this question coming off a day full of decisions that have objectively/logically correct answers, so it was nice to hear that, oh yeah, sometimes what feels right is the best decision. It flows in first person present, so first person present it is.

Cover letter assignment:

1. How can a cover letter actually hurt your chances to sell?
- A poorly written cover letter is the first thing that gets read. You don’t want a reader starting the story with a bad taste in their mouth.

2. What are some of the most common mistakes in cover letters?
- addressing editors incorrectly, and including things that don’t need to be there that end up making the cover letter too long.

3. Is “Dear Editor” an acceptable greeting?
- yes.

4. When are you permitted to use an editor’s first name?
- if the editor has previously responded to you using their first name.

5. When only do you list educational degrees?
- if it is in some way relevant to your story.

6. Should you ever summarize your story for the editor?
- nope

7. Should you ever summarize your story for the editor?
-nope x2

8. Should you ever summarize your story for the editor?
-nope x3

9. Will listing non-paying or token markets impress an editor?
- never list anything that doesn’t pay at least semi-pro.

10. If we have many credits, should we list them all? What’s a good average that won’t overwhelm an editor’s tired eyes? (Yes, I exceeded this.
Like the Pirate's Code, they're more like guidelines.)
- list your top handful that are most prestigious or are most similar to the market you’re submitting to.

11. Finally, what do you feel is the number one rule about cover letters?
- short and sweet.

SwiftPotato, I liked Orson Scott Card's book Characters and Viewpoint. His other book, specifically for SFF, is also good. Once I understood "free indirect discourse" (Card may not use that term), third person became much easier to write. Basically, it's the style of seamlessly going in and out of the POV character's thoughts in third person. No quotes, no italics, no "(s)he thought" - at least, not often. The jury's out on my execution, but to me it feels just as intimate as first person. Just from my VERY limited experience!

Forcing myself to conform to DF's preferences made me a better writer because I had to learn new skills. But I violated some of his other advice; he's trying to teach us newbs what works most of the time, for most students.

As Moon suggests, write your story the best way you can! We'll sell the stories that play to our strengths.

SwiftPotato, I liked Orson Scott Card's book Characters and Viewpoint. His other book, specifically for SFF, is also good. Once I understood "free indirect discourse" (Card may not use that term), third person became much easier to write. Basically, it's the style of seamlessly going in and out of the POV character's thoughts in third person. No quotes, no italics, no "(s)he thought" - at least, not often. The jury's out on my execution, but to me it feels just as intimate as first person. Just from my VERY limited experience!

Forcing myself to conform to DF's preferences made me a better writer because I had to learn new skills. But I violated some of his other advice; he's trying to teach us newbs what works most of the time, for most students.

As Moon suggests, write your story the best way you can! We'll sell the stories that play to our strengths.

Dean Wesley Smith taught me this, twenty-five or more years ago. He called it "third person, close." He said it's the best way to tell a story, and for the most part, he's right. That said, go look at his story in WotF Vol. 35, "The Lost Robot." You still choose the narrative voice that's right for the story you are telling. Gumshoe detective stories are a trope, and they usually start in first person. We expect it, it's familiar. So it's the right voice for Dean's detective story, even though Dean gave me that advice mentioned above.

It's a very good idea to learn how to write in third person close. What does the "close" part mean? Unlike third omniscient, where you are like God above looking down and even jumping into the minds of any of your characters utilzing certain tricks, close is the opposite. You are so deep inside the head of your protagonist, every detail you filter through to your reader comes through your protagonist's eyes and ears. You are so deep in their thoughts, you have no need to italicize them or even say "he thought." Your writing is so intensely centered in your protagonists POV, the reader can tell it's the protagonist's thoughts without tagging.

Like this:

Jim came around the corner of 35th Street and gasped. There was his high school flame, Miranda, standing in a blood-red dress with hands on her hips, gaze locked to his like she was about to read him his rights. Of all the places to meet again, out here on a Brooklyn sidewalk! Good lord, she was beautiful. Twenty years later, and she still looked like the girl he had picked up for senior prom. Twenty years later, and she still looked mad as a hornet for his leaving that night with another girl.

See that? We are staring out at the world through Jim's eyeballs, just like in first person, but we're writing it in third. Look at the lines: "Of all the places to meet again, out here on a Brooklyn sidewalk! Good lord, she was beautiful." Do we need to italicize those? Or write "he thought"? No. It's so obvious it's his thoughts, we don't have to do a thing.

Third person close is very powerful. It's the way to get the intimacy of first person into third person. Practice it. Keep your POV inside your protagonist's head and never leave it, and you can write their thoughts without the gear shift required through italics and "he thought" tags.

Leah, when you get the story done, let it rest and write your next. You already know you're one of the challenge beasties I've chosen for a critique this quarter. Send me the best of your two and I'll help you get it right.

Practice that riding. When I was a young man, I trained horses. When I competed in barrel racing, I worked with my horse all day long until we spun around those barrels so close I could scrape my knee on them. It's the only way you win a ribbon, because guess what? Everyone that hopes to win is doing the same thing. You have to do it better, and it often comes down to finesse in the turns, executed perfectly, and then racing hell-bent for the finish line.

Practice writing third person so close inside your protagonist, you don't need to italicize. STAY IN THEIR HEAD! NO INPUT TO THE READER OTHER THAN WHAT THEY EXPERIENCE OR KNOW. : )

Yee-ah!

Beastmaster Moon

Officer, thanks for the book rec! I'll definitely give that one a read! The third person close that you both talk about is usually what I'm most comfortable with, honestly, so it's very weird that I feel so decidedly comfortable with first person present for this story.

Moon, I'll definitely do this - much as I love this one, it still isn't finished, so I have no idea whether it'll be as strong (or stronger than) my first. However, I will certainly be sending along my best!

Thanks again, all - this was a really helpful discussion.

SwiftPotato, I liked Orson Scott Card's book Characters and Viewpoint.

I agree, this is a GREAT book to own.

I've read it at least three times. ...It's like an OCD.
I've read it at least three times. ...It's like an OCD.
I've read it at least three times. ...It's like an OCD.

And if you guys want to read something adorable, please check out WotF's latest blog. It's by our very own challenge beastie, THE GIRL IN THE GLASSES!

All I can say is, this is why we write.

https://www.writersofthefuture.com/book ... n-dawdler/

That's a lovely article: written by our own Girl-in-green-glasses and illustrated by a top notch artist.

Aw! My little boy had such a fun summer, and he was so proud to see HIS art on the blog.

Adorably cute article by GIRL IN THE GLASSES. She's the one you want to keep your eyes on – she's a rising star in WOTF and most likely to win the GOLDEN PEN AWARD within three years.

Well that's a big boost of encouragement to see! I see many rising stars, and I'm rooting to see peeps from the Wulf Pack on that stage. Seriously. Those early exercises already proved chops and I know there were several clever Q4 entries sent from this group. Fingers crossed as results approach.

Regardless of how last quarter went, if we keep our commitments, I expect there will be successes in quarter 1. And sales from our second stories All the best guys! Keep on pushing.

AND THIS IS ME CATCHING UP ON ASSIGNMENTS:

1. How can a cover letter actually hurt your chances to sell?
If you are unprofessional, it can paint you as, well, unprofessional. You don’t want to make the editor judge your attitude before they even get to the story. Be brief. Don’t list 20+ token credits, or they’ll think you’ve settled for the minor leagues and aren’t capable of selling higher. Don’t mix your nonfiction and fiction credits to sound more impressive. You’ll raise eyebrows…in a bad way.

2. What are some of the most common mistakes in cover letters?
Summarizing the story, inflating awards/accomplishments/mixing credits, telling the editor how amazing you are…

3. Is “Dear Editor” an acceptable greeting?
Sure. I liked “Gentlebeings.” Nice ring.

4. When are you permitted to use an editor’s first name?
When they’ve written back signed with their first name

5. When only do you list educational degrees?
If it is pertinent to the story (so in my case, if I’ve written a story about something in the medical field, I could mention I have an RN).

6. Should you ever summarize your story for the editor?
No

7. Should you ever summarize your story for the editor?
No

8. Should you ever summarize your story for the editor?
Hang on, let me check….It’s a no.

9. Will listing non-paying or token markets impress an editor?
No. Certainly not a reputable one.

10. If we have many credits, should we list them all? What’s a good average that won’t overwhelm an editor’s tired eyes? (Yes, I exceeded this.
Like the Pirate's Code, they're more like guidelines.)
3. Use the rule of three. (or 4)

11. Finally, what do you feel is the number one rule about cover letters?
Brevity (Although I think 6, 7, and 8 probably covered the most important one)

12. Finally finally. You have everything you need now to send your krakens out to sea. What are you waiting for? Get kraken!
I let it gooooo. Let it gooooo. Can’t hold it back anymore. Let it go. Let it goooo. (Okay, I’ll admit to too much Frozen at my house. What can I say, the sequel is upcoming?)

12. Finally finally. You have everything you need now to send your krakens out to sea. What are you waiting for? Get kraken!
I let it gooooo. Let it gooooo. Can’t hold it back anymore. Let it go. Let it goooo. (Okay, I’ll admit to too much Frozen at my house. What can I say, the sequel is upcoming?)

~/o The rejections never bothered me anyway. ~/o

~/o The rejections never bothered me anyway. ~/o

Dude, you're killing it.

Characters, Emotion & Viewpoint by Nancy Kress seems a great alternative to the Orson Scott Card book on the same topic. I haven't read the latter, but Kress' is apparently more in depth. She's a WotF judge too.

12. Finally finally. You have everything you need now to send your krakens out to sea. What are you waiting for? Get kraken!
I let it gooooo. Let it gooooo. Can’t hold it back anymore. Let it go. Let it goooo. (Okay, I’ll admit to too much Frozen at my house. What can I say, the sequel is upcoming?)

~/o The rejections never bothered me anyway. ~/o

BAHAHAHAHAHA!

MONDAY STORY PROMPT EARLY!

Officer, please link back to this on Monday. And here's why I interrupt this channel for an important announcement.

The last time there was massive political news sweeping the nation, Dave commented that he received many stories about governments betraying a protagonist. He spoke favorably about this, saying he received many noteworthy stories on the subject, and viewed them as writers dealing with their feelings through fiction. So what does this tell us? I'll venture some guesses. Dave watches the news, he is up on current events. Dave likes stories that deal with political intrique. He is not afraid of choosing some of these stories to make the WotF Volume relevant to current societal concerns. Like any good editor, he seeks good stories that have depth and make statements about the concerns humanity has.

Well, there's another such issue in the news. Dave lives in this country, he is certainly aware of it and is no doubt following it. While WotF is not a political publication, I will venture to my challenge beasties a story reflecting some of the issues along these lines might strike a chord in Dave--it did before, and he wrote about it in his tips. True, since this current news cycle is part of the collective consciousness, there will likely be other stories reflecting these issues. Still, my guess is someone is going to write a good one, and it could end up in the finalist selections.

So, if you'd like to have at it, I give you your Monday prompt, ahead of time so you can have more time to work on it. Here it is:

An alternative narrative destroys a faithful ambassador to a foreign country (fantasy) or an alien world (science fiction).

May the Force be with you! (BTW, today is the half way mark for Q1. By now, you have one story of 3000 words or more completed and are working on your next. Right?
Beastmaster Moon

Please join me in congratulating our challenge beastie Crystal Crawford on delivering a real baby boy kraken into this world! I've seen the pictures, he's adorable, and he's got the full set of tentacles. Mom and baby are doing well!

Congratulations, Crystal!

Please join me in congratulating our challenge beastie Crystal Crawford on delivering a real baby boy kraken into this world! I've seen the pictures, he's adorable, and he's got the full set of tentacles. Mom and baby are doing well!

Go baby! Congratulations! Hope mama is resting well and all is good with the baby! Welcome to Earth!

Yay! Congratulations, Crystal! Get some rest, do some healing, and enjoy your new little one.

Congratulations, Crystal, on the birth of your new son. I'm glad to hear both of you are doing fine.

Best,

Retro

Congratulations Crystal on the birth of your child.

Crystal Crawford, congratulations on the healthy baby kraken! I hope you are both doing well and sleeping some. Take good care of yourself while you wrestle the lovely wee kraken.

Greetings Wulf pack. Hope the writing is going well for everyone. And congrats Crystal!

I’m hoping to solicit some suggestions from the group. I’ve got about 30 hours of driving ahead of me soon. If you have any suggestions of writing instruction audiobooks/podcasts, please enlighten.

I figure this might be helpful for others in the pack/lurkers as well. Given I will be driving, please limit commentary to things that you know to be in audio format.

No quotes, no italics, no "(s)he thought"

Dean Wesley Smith taught me this, twenty-five or more years ago. He called it "third person, close.

OMG! What is this dark magic? ... I'll have a go at applying this for Q1.

Wulf, apologies as work is demanding 'an impossible task' (John Wick reference), so will have to play tomato ketchup on challenges.

No quotes, no italics, no "(s)he thought"

Dean Wesley Smith taught me this, twenty-five or more years ago. He called it "third person, close.

OMG! What is this dark magic? ... I'll have a go at applying this for Q1.

Wulf, apologies as work is demanding 'an impossible task' (John Wick reference), so will have to play tomato ketchup on challenges.

As long as it's Heinz. None of this Del Monte cat soup, Peter!

I’ve found the concept of free indirect speech to be very helpful too - it’s basically what is being discussed here. I heard it from Mary Robinette Kowal on writing excuses.

Congratulations Crystal Crawford!

I’m hoping to solicit some suggestions from the group. I’ve got about 30 hours of driving ahead of me soon. If you have any suggestions of writing instruction audiobooks/podcasts, please enlighten.

Writing excuses poscast is great. I think it was season 11 that focused on elemental genre that was particulary good. Other than that I've just started Dave farland audiobook million dollar outlines.

I’m hoping to solicit some suggestions from the group. I’ve got about 30 hours of driving ahead of me soon. If you have any suggestions of writing instruction audiobooks/podcasts, please enlighten.

Writing excuses poscast is great. I think it was season 11 that focused on elemental genre that was particulary good. Other than that I've just started Dave farland audiobook million dollar outlines.

Thanks! Yes I’ve listened to pretty much every writing excuses episode, and Farland’s million dollar outline and drawing on resonance. If anyone hasn’t listened to/read these, they are definitely worth it.

A quote that reinforces the relevance of this week's Monday prompt. John le Carre' was asked why he works the atmosphere of current political events into his stories. Answer? "Let me just say first of all that always in my books I've tried to live the passion of my time."