Discussion: Q3 Volume 38

I have thought about aiming for 100 rejections a year but I don't have quite enough stories for that and also tend to be an up and down submitter (submit a bunch in a row then don't submit anything for a while). Have recently got a few more really close to ready to start on the circuit.

I did 'sell' one flash fiction story a couple years back to an anthology (sub pro pay rate) and that did get my hopes up that more of my stories would sell soon. Still waiting on that pro-sale debut but will keep on keeping on (do have two out other than my WoTF entries that I keep playing rejectomancy by watching for bolded recent results on Submission Grinder).

In the meantime one of those stories that is very close to ready is the one for Q1 - so I'll be over in a corner of the blanket fort with everyone else, both thinking about my stories out there in the world and those I'm getting ready to send out to join them. Tonight feels like maybe milky tea topped with whipped cream with just a tiny bit of maple syrup for sweetening and maybe some of that fruit tray someone has on offer

Posted by: @alexvss

@aliciacay Wow, some scavenging you did there! Thanks!

Liu's experience with rejection reminded of what Mary Robinette Kowal says at the end of Writing Excuses' episode on short-story markets (give it a listen, it's super short). She talks about how writers get overconfident after selling two stories: they think that they had it all figured out. But they just stop selling because they're too focused on the craft, rather than putting their hearts in the stories. Liu's interview sounded just like that. 

 

 

I can relate to that idea of how a taste of success can waylay us. I'm going to go listen to this episode this evening. Thank you for posting it! I think it does go hand in hand with what Liu said, and is a good reminder to keep working on our words, finding our own voices, and growing as writers and humans. Keep going and let go of what we think the outcome "should" be. The success will come. ❤

~A.

All this talk of submissions and rejections made me go submit two stories See twitching and talking about it helps!!!

Posted by: @aliciacay

To that I say, my story that just sold to a pro-paying market at 8 cents a word was out on it's 16th submission and had earned me a Silver HM in the WotF contest from Dave.
I DID NOT update or tweak it from it's original submission to WotF. It was sent there first, earned me a Silver HM, and then I continued to send it out 15 more times.

I have a writing friend who won a name-worthy, big writing contest with a story that had been rejected from the top pro-paying markets FIFTEEN times. That author got paid pro-rates for that story, a gorgeous trophy, and additional prizes.

Also, in Kevin J. Anderson's new, little book: Slushpile Memories: How NOT to get rejected. He tells an anecdote about the very first writing award he ever won--it was for "The Writer with No Future" because he was able to produce by weight more rejection slips than any other writer at that convention. He goes on to say he took that trophy home as a badge of honor, more determined than ever to not give up.

I think the message from Liu and KJA are clear. Keep sending out your stories, keep writing new words, and never give up, never surrender. ♥

 

~A.

I love this. This gives me so much hope. Thank you for posting!

Posted by: @aliciacay

keep working on our words, finding our own voices, and growing as writers and humans. Keep going and let go of what we think the outcome "should" be. The success will come. ❤

~A.

Very warming and encouraging, Alicia. I write because I enjoy the writing—the idea, the craft, finding a way to make it interesting to others, expressing ideas through science fiction that can't be expressed most other ways. So I write, regardless of the outcome with the (stupid) editors.

For those who have trouble keeping up with subs, I've found that The Submission Grinder ( https://thegrinder.diabolicalplots.com) is a big help. I use it to keep track of the stories I've written and the markets I'm submitting to. Each time I get a rejection, I turn around and use the site to find another market for that story. That way, I keep the sub queues full. I have 11 stories in my repertoire so far and have 9 active subs pending response. (I only sub to pro-level markets.)

The stories I write these days are sort of like time travel. I can go back to the past or into the future. Near future or centuries from now can be imagined and world's created. The same goes for the distant past. What if our ancestors migrated from Mars and our race is much older than anyone thinks?  

Posted by: @alexvss

@aliciacay Wow, some scavenging you did there! Thanks!

Liu's experience with rejection reminded of what Mary Robinette Kowal says at the end of Writing Excuses' episode on short-story markets (give it a listen, it's super short). She talks about how writers get overconfident after selling two stories: they think that they had it all figured out. But they just stop selling because they're too focused on the craft, rather than putting their hearts in the stories. Liu's interview sounded just like that. 

 

 

I listened to that episode last night. Wow! Her words hit me in a way I'd never gotten before. I had a lightbulb moment.

Once we as writers 'know' we can write a competent story, a good story, then instead of focusing on the craft trying to replicate a prior sale, in a way what we need to do is what Liu said in his interview. The next leveling up step we can take is what Mary Robinette Kowal says at the end of that episode.

My mind was blown. Loved it! Thank you for sharing!

~A.

Posted by: @ehonour

Posted by: @aliciacay

keep working on our words, finding our own voices, and growing as writers and humans. Keep going and let go of what we think the outcome "should" be. The success will come. ❤

~A.

Very warming and encouraging, Alicia. I write because I enjoy the writing—the idea, the craft, finding a way to make it interesting to others, expressing ideas through science fiction that can't be expressed most other ways. So I write, regardless of the outcome with the (stupid) editors.

For those who have trouble keeping up with subs, I've found that The Submission Grinder ( https://thegrinder.diabolicalplots.com) is a big help. I use it to keep track of the stories I've written and the markets I'm submitting to. Each time I get a rejection, I turn around and use the site to find another market for that story. That way, I keep the sub queues full. I have 11 stories in my repertoire so far and have 9 active subs pending response. (I only sub to pro-level markets.)

Yes, I use the submission grinder and I find it wonderful for keeping track, stats, and finding new markets! I also highly recommend.

I love that you mention writing for the enjoyment of it. I really think that is a marker for success--almost in a paradoxical way bc the 'enjoyment' of writing itself IS the success 😉

I believe it was King who said, "If you can do it for joy, you can do it for life."

And your comment, (stupid) editors gave me a giggle. Sometime I also shake my fists at the sky against them--LOL.
Mike Resnick said in an essay in one of the WotF volumes that even after having so many stories accepted and published when he got a rejection he would say to himself: "Oh yeah, buddy, I'll show you."
I need to dig this essay out to share the exact volume with everyone, but I adored his 'shake his fist' at them grit. It makes me grin 😀

Best of luck in Q4!

~A. ♥

Anyone heard word on the results? We're nearing the closing date and judging for Q4. 

Let me check my inbox. Nope, nothing there. Nada dang thing.  

Posted by: @phantomhill

Anyone heard word on the results? We're nearing the closing date and judging for Q4. 

Somewhere above Wulf mentioned it would be a while yet. Judge business and the Gala are putting a delay on 3 this year. 4 will probably be quick as usual.

Yeah, I'm becoming tempted to take advantage of the delay and submit early in October, just so I can have three stories pending at WotF for the first time ever...I mean, it's a sort of a goal, right?

Posted by: @doctorjest

Yeah, I'm becoming tempted to take advantage of the delay and submit early in October, just so I can have three stories pending at WotF for the first time ever...I mean, it's a sort of a goal, right?

It's a really interesting feeling, that's for sure. I was really pushing for it the last year or so. Managed it multiple quarters in a row. It was probably a silly thing to feel proud of, but it made me feel proud nonetheless.  

Managed it multiple quarters in a row. It was probably a silly thing to feel proud of, but it made me feel proud nonetheless.  

That ain't silly! That's pounding on that door or you'll blow that house down, & you did! 

Posted by: @doctorjest

Yeah, I'm becoming tempted to take advantage of the delay and submit early in October, just so I can have three stories pending at WotF for the first time ever...I mean, it's a sort of a goal, right?

That's great, you guys.
I haven't put in my Q4 yet, but definitely will.
My Q1 is nowhere near ready, so unless they take a very long time judging Q3, no three simultaneous subs for me.  

But you guys can go your hardest!!

Alicia,
if I may ask, what was the word count for your story you sold after 16 subs? I mostly ask because several of my stories only have like 6-7 solid options on the grinder. A few more that pay less than 2 cents a word, but I didn't think most of them were great options.

Posted by: @scott_m_sands

Alicia,
if I may ask, what was the word count for your story you sold after 16 subs? I mostly ask because several of my stories only have like 6-7 solid options on the grinder. A few more that pay less than 2 cents a word, but I didn't think most of them were great options.

 

Sure thing! That story was 2,900 words, and if I recall correctly, the anthology call was for stories under 3k words.

I have a longer story at 11k, and yeah, that one had very few higher paying market options. I've sent it everywhere at pro rates, and am now just holding onto it for an anthology call or new market that may come up in the future.

I've found many editors and submission calls stating they prefer stories at or under 5K, occasionally some will accept up to 7.5k. Those editors and calls often state their sweet spot in regards to word count, and some will tell you that the shorter the stories they accept, the more they can buy. So, just things to keep in mind.

The more I write short stories the more under 5k I tend to prefer to stick, just personally. BUT of course some stories *need* to be longer and edge up toward that 7k count 😉

Also, truth moment, my preference for stories to come in UNDER 5,000 words has grown exponentially after I started reading slush for a speculative magazine. Again, that's some of my preference and bias showing through, so take it all with a grain of salt and then do what's right for your story and art ❤

~A.

@aliciacay 
Thanks for the prompt reply. And for sharing about your story.

My stories that don't have many options left at pro rates are around 7-8k. I definitely try to take notice when markets specifically list their sweet spot. Has to help. Gosh though, I've already written a number of 'short stories' then realised that they're not meant to be short stories at all-they are most definitely novels.

Short stories are fun though, as you don't have to spend months writing them and you can enjoy fresh concepts. Novels are also fun.  

Always great to take what works for someone else and say when and how it can apply to your own art.

I honestly love writing my short stories, just because I get to experiment with new ideas and try to put an interesting spin on certain tropes. Plus, it gives me the benefit of being able to flesh out my novels' fantasy world, so there's that.

No sense twitching with the upcoming gala, but I'm going to  since results last year came on Oct 5th. So what's a forumite to do?: daydream about that call from Joni, write, daydream, write, daydream, daydream, daydream, rinse, repeat. At least, that's me. 

Does checking my emails more often than usual count as twitching? if so then I am guilty.

Have the results for Q3 come out?

Gotta admit, I've been biting my nails the last few days in anticipation. I'll be glad when results come out. Then I can relax for another two months before the cycle starts all over again!

@ginutg, not yet, surely for most anyhow, as many forumites post their individual results here when they get em’. My understanding is that Joni calls the finalists before the emails get sent out, so maybe they’ll be coming soon. Though with the upcoming gala, WOTF has got its plate full this quarter, so results might be later than previous 3rd Quarters.

@earthkeeper78 Oh I hear you loud and louder. It is going to be the same for me I imagine even though it was my first attempt.

@jeschleicher , I see. Thanks for that man. I can relax now. 

Personally I’m not twitching until after the gala. If results are before that, it’ll be a nice surprise. But I suspect they all have hands full with travel arrangements and dress alterations and catering and such, and we’ll get results sometime toward the end of the month. Write on!

@rschibler oh okay. Makes sense. Good luck everybody.

I've experienced enough rejection (in WOTF and elsewhere) that I don't even bother twitching anymore. I crafted the best story I could, I sent it out, at that point it's out of my hands until it comes back to me — in whatever shape it comes back. I try and stay busy writing the next thing and attempting to make it even better. I'm playing the long game. 😉 

Posted by: @morgan-broadhead

I've experienced enough rejection (in WOTF and elsewhere) that I don't even bother twitching anymore. I crafted the best story I could, I sent it out, at that point it's out of my hands until it comes back to me — in whatever shape it comes back. I try and stay busy writing the next thing and attempting to make it even better. I'm playing the long game. 😉 

Well said, Morgan. I've had three more rejections in the last two days. I know they're all good stories—not just from my own impression, but from that of various critics who've read them and helped. (As well as two Finalist selections in another contest.)

So with each rejection, I simply (a) go look for another market for that story, and (b) go look for another story to submit to that market.

Then I go back to writing the next story or the next chapter. As your Stephen King quote says, let's do it for the enjoyment of the writing. Any publication or awards are simply icing on the cake.