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Discussion: Q3 Volume 36

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tkunit
(@tkunit)
Advanced Member
Posts: 25

And since I still am forgetting to come here what podcast?

Started at the end of March. Couldn't find an official link from writersofthefuture.com but here are some links (you can subscribe from wherever you get your podcasts).

https://mytuner-radio.com/podcasts/writ ... 1458235353
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/w ... 1458235353

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Posted : June 25, 2019 4:56 am
JVAshley
(@jvashley)
Silver Member
Posts: 262

I did major revisions this afternoon. Now for the spit polish. Who knows...maybe I'll go all crazy and turn it in a day early? wotf017

wotf019 Who am I kidding?

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Posted : June 25, 2019 4:53 pm
Henckel
(@henckel)
Silver Member
Posts: 417

I did major revisions this afternoon. Now for the spit polish. Who knows...maybe I'll go all crazy and turn it in a day early?

Oh let's not get hasty. Don't want to create false expectations wotf007

(2014) V31 Q1 – R
(2018) V35 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q4 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q1 – R
(2020) V37 Q2 – HM
(2020) V37 Q3 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2021) V38 Q1 – Semi-finalist
(2021) V38 Q2 – SHM
(2021) V38 Q3 – tba

Coolest Achievements
(2019) Published in Escape Anthology
(2020) Published in Sci-Fi Lampoon
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2020) Dream Foundry - Shortlisted
(2021) Mike Resnick Memorial Award - 3rd Place winner!!! (to be published)

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Posted : June 25, 2019 7:28 pm
TimE
 TimE
(@time)
Silver Member
Posts: 339

Finished my Q3, waiting on a few crits to smooth out, but will be submitted with a few days to spare. I haven't kept count, but must have entered 8 or 9 consecutive quarters now. This will be my 3rd written specifically for WotF.

Better start thinking about Q4.

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Posted : June 25, 2019 7:48 pm
JVAshley
(@jvashley)
Silver Member
Posts: 262

Oh let's not get hasty. Don't want to create false expectations wotf007

“But I spoke hastily. We must not be hasty." - Treebeard, The Two Towers
Wise Words Dear Treebeard and Mister Henckel. wotf001

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Posted : June 26, 2019 4:18 am
czing
(@czing)
Bronze Star Member
Posts: 196

In other news... Do you have any Reccomendations. I'm looking for publisher for my novelette. It got HM last year in Q3. It's 15600 words. Sci Fi. It's an unorthodox love story set in amidst a futuristic jailbreak. An has a unique mind bender of an ending. Complex and poetic.

I'm not fussed about being paid. But really really want this published in hard copy.

I've checked submission grinder and then did general google search on submissions, but nothing really fits... Also, I'm not going to waste my time with analogue, asimov, or magazine of f&sf. I mean the story is good, but not that good.

Any sugestions? Otherwise I'll resort to self publishing.... And have the same 11 people buy it as my last self published story (thanks mom)

I agree with Helge. By no means do I consider myself the best writer out there but I always start with high level paying markets first. I admit so far that hasn't netted me a lot of results but my submission count is probably only 20ish total so far so....

At that length you could consider Clarkesworld - they've upped their word count limit to 22K I think and mentioned on Twitter that people aren't really submitting the long pieces yet despite their increased word count limit. I know it is on my radar for one of my stories (assuming it doesn't end up winning this contest).

Shoot for the starts - don't undersell yourself!

v36 Q1, Q3 - HM; Q4 - R
v37 Q1 - R; Q2 - SHM; Q4 - HM
v38 Q1 - HM; Q2 -SHM; Q3 - P

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Posted : June 26, 2019 5:22 am
Wulf Moon
(@wulfmoon)
Platinum Plus Member Moderator
Posts: 2277

I used to espouse this same belief: Start at the top and work your way down. We say it because all the experts say it. It is said so much it must be true, right?

From my own experiences, I've found this canon belief isn't true. And I suspect this rule is holding a lot of good writers back from getting good sales and getting published.

It's like telling a novice mountain climber, "Start with Everest and work your way down to the lower elevation mountains." And so the novice takes the advice, finds out he doesn't have the skills to climb Everest yet, and even if he by some miracle gets close, the only trail up is blocked by all the expert climbers. But everyone says this is the way you climb mountains, so that novice is only going to believe he has mastered mountain climbing by climbing Everest.

Meanwhile, someone saw a clear path up a 6K, focused all their efforts on it, and made it to the top. And again. Then climbed their first 14er. Then did a set of 14ers. And built up such a good reputation of successes, people asked if they'd like to join them on more difficult climbs. Maybe that climber never gets to Everest. He doesn't care.

He's cleaning up down below.

What I'm trying to say is that there's another way in. No, not starting at the bottom and working your way up--your writing is better than that, right? Focusing on markets where your skill level is at. I call this going in sideways and working your way up.

I'll do a SUPER SECRET on this soon if you're interested. Deadlines right now, just as they are for you.

All the beast on your Q3s! You have until midnight this Sunday. As Tim Gunn would say on Project Runway, "Make it work!"

JOIN THE WULF PACK! http://the super secrets.com
"Super-Duper Moongirl and the Amazing Moon Dawdler" wins WRITERS OF THE FUTURE VOL. 35 & BEST SF&F STORY OF 2019. Order WotF Volume 35 HERE!
“Muzik Man" in Deep Magic Fall 2020 wins BEST SF&F STORY of 2020
NEW! Don't miss the Super Secret "Character Agency: I Need a Hero!" in DreamForge Anvil Magazine!
JUST RELEASED! BEST OF DEEP MAGIC ANTHOLOGY TWO! Three Super Secrets Workshop members made it into this best of the best anthology! KD Julicher, Brittany Rainsdon, and some guy named Wulf Moon. Click HERE to get yours!
NEXT MASTER CLASSES AT FYRECON ONLINE, NOV. 18-21ST. Click HERE before they are sold out once again!

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Posted : June 26, 2019 6:17 am
DoctorJest
(@doctorjest)
Silver Member
Posts: 361

One separate thing I would recommend is submitting to markets that give good feedback. Many give just form responses, but some are far more forthcoming and helpful, and as such, very valuable to someone trying to hone their craft. Leading Edge is one such--not swift, for sure, but the couple of times I've submitted there, I've received thorough, excellent feedback.

R: 0 / HM: 8 / SHM: 4 / SF: 0 / F: 1
Currently in for Q3.V38 and Q4.V38 / Q1.V39 20% done on draft 1
Last result: SHM for Q2.V38
Revised SHM ('Ashwright') at PodCastle
Revised HM ('The Winds of the Mind') forthcoming at Abyss and Apex, ~October 2023

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Posted : June 26, 2019 6:51 am
jficke13
(@jficke13)
Bronze Member
Posts: 80

Re: What markets to sub to, Tim Powers shared his thoughts on this subject for the Vol 34 crew.

He said, essentially, that the trunk exists for a reason. Write out a list of all the markets you may sub to and rank them #1 on down. When you're done, re-read it and think about where you no longer would be happy to see your name in print, draw a line there. Start at the top and sub your way to the line but never below that line.

His reasoning was simple: He thinks you should set a standard of excellence for your work and not settle with violating that standard just to chase a publication credit. He used the editors' judgment as a litmus test for whether it's worth putting your name on it. Rejected by (your chosen markets)? Maybe it just wasn't good enough, write something new.

Just another perspective.

HM x2, Vol. 34 Q4 - 3rd. http://www.jonficke.com

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Posted : June 26, 2019 8:52 am
Henckel
(@henckel)
Silver Member
Posts: 417

Thanks everyone for all your comments and diverse advice.
I really appreciate your input wotf009

(2014) V31 Q1 – R
(2018) V35 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q4 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q1 – R
(2020) V37 Q2 – HM
(2020) V37 Q3 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2021) V38 Q1 – Semi-finalist
(2021) V38 Q2 – SHM
(2021) V38 Q3 – tba

Coolest Achievements
(2019) Published in Escape Anthology
(2020) Published in Sci-Fi Lampoon
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2020) Dream Foundry - Shortlisted
(2021) Mike Resnick Memorial Award - 3rd Place winner!!! (to be published)

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Posted : June 26, 2019 9:20 am
Wulf Moon
(@wulfmoon)
Platinum Plus Member Moderator
Posts: 2277

Thanks everyone for all your comments and diverse advice.
I really appreciate your input wotf009

That was the funny thing at the WotF workshop. Our three instructors--Card, Farland, and Powers--often had completely divergent advice (except for writing in first person. All three asserted it was absolutely the wrong way to write a story. wotf011 ) And then when other pros came in at the end of the week? They countered many things we were taught in the workshop--especially was this the case with Dean Wesley Smith. I said a few words to Dean just before he went up to teach--we're old friends. "Hey, Dean, we've heard the traditional side all week. I'm glad you're here. You ready to blow things up?" He laughed. "That's why I'm here. I love blowing things up."

Dean came at everything from an entirely different angle, being an Indie writer and publisher. It was refreshing, even if you had no plans to go Indie. Dean took an entirely different path, has worked his whole life thinking outside the box, and was just as successful as any other writer in that room.

You listen. You take notes. And you figure out your own path.

In the end, that will be the right path for you.

JOIN THE WULF PACK! http://the super secrets.com
"Super-Duper Moongirl and the Amazing Moon Dawdler" wins WRITERS OF THE FUTURE VOL. 35 & BEST SF&F STORY OF 2019. Order WotF Volume 35 HERE!
“Muzik Man" in Deep Magic Fall 2020 wins BEST SF&F STORY of 2020
NEW! Don't miss the Super Secret "Character Agency: I Need a Hero!" in DreamForge Anvil Magazine!
JUST RELEASED! BEST OF DEEP MAGIC ANTHOLOGY TWO! Three Super Secrets Workshop members made it into this best of the best anthology! KD Julicher, Brittany Rainsdon, and some guy named Wulf Moon. Click HERE to get yours!
NEXT MASTER CLASSES AT FYRECON ONLINE, NOV. 18-21ST. Click HERE before they are sold out once again!

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Posted : June 26, 2019 9:47 am
Henckel
(@henckel)
Silver Member
Posts: 417

I completely agree. While there's nothing but good intent behind advice, not all advice is the right fit for all people.

I felt the same way listening to one of the WOTF podcasts. I forget who was being interviewed. Some advice about not overpolishing your stories because they'll just come out looking like just another smooth stone....

Respectfully, many professionals can get away with that. But not new aspiring writers. Unique and innovative is good. But if an editor, agent, publisher sees something risky like that from an unknown author, they won't even read it.
Why? Because they are in the business of making money. And the risk associated with unpolished prose from a well known established author is far less than that of an unknown new author.

Those are my thoughts.

(2014) V31 Q1 – R
(2018) V35 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q4 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q1 – R
(2020) V37 Q2 – HM
(2020) V37 Q3 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2021) V38 Q1 – Semi-finalist
(2021) V38 Q2 – SHM
(2021) V38 Q3 – tba

Coolest Achievements
(2019) Published in Escape Anthology
(2020) Published in Sci-Fi Lampoon
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2020) Dream Foundry - Shortlisted
(2021) Mike Resnick Memorial Award - 3rd Place winner!!! (to be published)

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Posted : June 26, 2019 4:51 pm
DaneCurley
(@danecurley)
Bronze Member
Posts: 50

First timer. wotf009

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Posted : June 27, 2019 3:58 am
LittleRed
(@littlered)
Advanced Member
Posts: 29

wotf017 Hmmmm I just replied, agreeing with one of Hencke's points. At first my post appeared and then it disappeared. Was it a glitch or did it get deleted by nefarious thread gnomes?

If this world holds no wonder, it is no place for me.

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Posted : June 27, 2019 4:30 am
Disgruntled Peony
(@disgruntledpeony)
Gold Star Member
Posts: 1113

I completely agree. While there's nothing but good intent behind advice, not all advice is the right fit for all people.

I felt the same way listening to one of the WOTF podcasts. I forget who was being interviewed. Some advice about not overpolishing your stories because they'll just come out looking like just another smooth stone....

Respectfully, many professionals can get away with that. But not new aspiring writers. Unique and innovative is good. But if an editor, agent, publisher sees something risky like that from an unknown author, they won't even read it.
Why? Because they are in the business of making money. And the risk associated with unpolished prose from a well known established author is far less than that of an unknown new author.

Those are my thoughts.

When it all comes down to it, no advice is right for everyone. I'm a weird combination of pantser and plotter--how far I lean in either direction depends on the story. The rough draft of my Q3 was absolutely pantsed in a day, although I'd been chewing on aspects of the story in my head for quite a long time. I polished it into something readable, sent it out to critiquers, and talked it over with my husband. Ended up making some semi-heavy edits to a few scenes and rewriting one scene completely because my husband and I figured out a better way to convey the message I wanted and crank the tension up at the same time. Doing my final pass today.

Will I write my next story using the same methods? Probably not. That's okay, though. As long as the end result is good, the production process is allowed (perhaps even expected) to be a bit messy.

If you are in difficulties with a book, try the element of surprise: attack it at an hour when it isn't expecting it. ~ H.G. Wells
R, SF, SHM, SHM, SHM, F, R, HM, SHM, R, HM, R, F, SHM, SHM, SHM, SF, SHM, 1st Place (Q2 V38)
Ticknor Tales

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Posted : June 27, 2019 4:51 am
TimE
 TimE
(@time)
Silver Member
Posts: 339

I completely agree. While there's nothing but good intent behind advice, not all advice is the right fit for all people.

I felt the same way listening to one of the WOTF podcasts. I forget who was being interviewed. Some advice about not overpolishing your stories because they'll just come out looking like just another smooth stone....

Respectfully, many professionals can get away with that. But not new aspiring writers. Unique and innovative is good. But if an editor, agent, publisher sees something risky like that from an unknown author, they won't even read it.
Why? Because they are in the business of making money. And the risk associated with unpolished prose from a well known established author is far less than that of an unknown new author.

Those are my thoughts.

I think you said you write humour, Henckel. I've had this discussion with Wulf. You'll see many advise that humour must be edited much more often because it's about wringing every laugh you can. So, not just about being polished writing. I think Wulf referred to an author who does edit a lot (haven't looked back) - and everyone has different methods. But I do get the notion of over-polishing. Listen to every crit you get and you might just edit so much, you end up with something that no one objects to, but loses your own style.
As for the unique and innovative - it's a line you'll hear from a number of people around WotF. It's not about being risky, it's about standing out.

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Posted : June 27, 2019 5:06 am
Disgruntled Peony
(@disgruntledpeony)
Gold Star Member
Posts: 1113

And I'm in.

If you are in difficulties with a book, try the element of surprise: attack it at an hour when it isn't expecting it. ~ H.G. Wells
R, SF, SHM, SHM, SHM, F, R, HM, SHM, R, HM, R, F, SHM, SHM, SHM, SF, SHM, 1st Place (Q2 V38)
Ticknor Tales

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Posted : June 27, 2019 6:26 am
ZeeTeeBeeZ
(@zeeteebeez)
Bronze Star Member
Posts: 151

One separate thing I would recommend is submitting to markets that give good feedback. Many give just form responses, but some are far more forthcoming and helpful, and as such, very valuable to someone trying to hone their craft. Leading Edge is one such--not swift, for sure, but the couple of times I've submitted there, I've received thorough, excellent feedback.

Man, this is huge. After about 5 years of submitting to WOTF on and off, I'm realizing how valuable it is to me to have some extra eyes on it to iron out some wrinkles I hadn't noticed. Beta readers, critique services, magazine submissions that will give good feedback, can all be great resources.

Q3's submission is the first time I've really gotten some feedback before submitting. Hoping to push a little farther than another HM this time!

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Posted : June 27, 2019 6:46 am
LDWriter2
(@ldwriter2)
Gold Star Member
Posts: 1263

And since I still am forgetting to come here what podcast?

Started at the end of March. Couldn't find an official link from writersofthefuture.com but here are some links (you can subscribe from wherever you get your podcasts).

https://mytuner-radio.com/podcasts/writ ... 1458235353
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/w ... 1458235353

Thanks I tried to remember if I saw an E-mail about that.

Working on turning Lead into Gold.
Four HMs From WotF
The latest was Q1'12
HM-quarter 4 Volume 32
One HM for another contest
published in Strange New Worlds Ten.
Another HM http://onthepremises.com/minis/mini_18.html

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Posted : June 27, 2019 11:33 am
BrandieJ
(@brandiej)
Advanced Member
Posts: 33

Just submitted!

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Posted : June 27, 2019 2:38 pm
Henckel
(@henckel)
Silver Member
Posts: 417

Just submitted!

Good work!!!!!  fistinair

(2014) V31 Q1 – R
(2018) V35 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q4 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q1 – R
(2020) V37 Q2 – HM
(2020) V37 Q3 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2021) V38 Q1 – Semi-finalist
(2021) V38 Q2 – SHM
(2021) V38 Q3 – tba

Coolest Achievements
(2019) Published in Escape Anthology
(2020) Published in Sci-Fi Lampoon
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2020) Dream Foundry - Shortlisted
(2021) Mike Resnick Memorial Award - 3rd Place winner!!! (to be published)

ReplyQuote
Posted : June 27, 2019 7:41 pm
Henckel
(@henckel)
Silver Member
Posts: 417

And I'm in.

Ya know, just looking at your trajectory (SHMs, SFs, and F) I can't help but to admire your commitment. I suspect your on the cusp of a win.

Best of luck to you this quarter and to everyone.

(2014) V31 Q1 – R
(2018) V35 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q4 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q1 – R
(2020) V37 Q2 – HM
(2020) V37 Q3 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2021) V38 Q1 – Semi-finalist
(2021) V38 Q2 – SHM
(2021) V38 Q3 – tba

Coolest Achievements
(2019) Published in Escape Anthology
(2020) Published in Sci-Fi Lampoon
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2020) Dream Foundry - Shortlisted
(2021) Mike Resnick Memorial Award - 3rd Place winner!!! (to be published)

ReplyQuote
Posted : June 27, 2019 7:45 pm
DoctorJest
(@doctorjest)
Silver Member
Posts: 361

And, in. Phew. Honestly wasn't sure if I would get this one finished in time, but happy that I did.

R: 0 / HM: 8 / SHM: 4 / SF: 0 / F: 1
Currently in for Q3.V38 and Q4.V38 / Q1.V39 20% done on draft 1
Last result: SHM for Q2.V38
Revised SHM ('Ashwright') at PodCastle
Revised HM ('The Winds of the Mind') forthcoming at Abyss and Apex, ~October 2023

ReplyQuote
Posted : June 27, 2019 7:57 pm
Disgruntled Peony
(@disgruntledpeony)
Gold Star Member
Posts: 1113

Ya know, just looking at your trajectory (SHMs, SFs, and F) I can't help but to admire your commitment. I suspect your on the cusp of a win.

It's not so much a trajectory as a spatter pattern, if we're being honest. wotf019

Also, I daren't get my hopes up. Even if I make finalist again, the odds are only 3 in 8 of placing. Not bad, but not great either. Better that I try for it but not expect it, because overly high expectations can lead to crushed spirits. The flat rejection I got the quarter after my finalist piece hit me pretty hard--but a modified version of that story was my second sale (currently pending publication). My aim has always been to win or to pro out; either way I'm making progress as a writer, and will hopefully gain the courage to take my next steps on the journey.

If you are in difficulties with a book, try the element of surprise: attack it at an hour when it isn't expecting it. ~ H.G. Wells
R, SF, SHM, SHM, SHM, F, R, HM, SHM, R, HM, R, F, SHM, SHM, SHM, SF, SHM, 1st Place (Q2 V38)
Ticknor Tales

ReplyQuote
Posted : June 27, 2019 11:08 pm
vsutherland01
(@vsutherland01)
Advanced Member
Posts: 34

I'm in with a fresh story for Q3.

Honorable Mentions: 4
Rejections: 5

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Posted : June 28, 2019 8:18 am
Henckel
(@henckel)
Silver Member
Posts: 417

Sounds like a solid plan.

I've learned a LOT since my HM last year and put in a lot of effort to making this Qs sub the best it can be....

I'm in a weird transition with my writing. I know what I need to do and I've got a reasonable amount of practice doing it. But I still need practice to master doing all the essential pieces at the same time in the same story.

I don't want to undersell myself or set myself up for disappointment. So my expectations for this sub is (hopefully) something above an HM.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love a win. And I'm shooting for a win. But will be content with an upward trajectory. wotf011

(2014) V31 Q1 – R
(2018) V35 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q3 – HM
(2019) V36 Q4 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q1 – R
(2020) V37 Q2 – HM
(2020) V37 Q3 – SHM
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2021) V38 Q1 – Semi-finalist
(2021) V38 Q2 – SHM
(2021) V38 Q3 – tba

Coolest Achievements
(2019) Published in Escape Anthology
(2020) Published in Sci-Fi Lampoon
(2020) V37 Q4 – Finalist
(2020) Dream Foundry - Shortlisted
(2021) Mike Resnick Memorial Award - 3rd Place winner!!! (to be published)

ReplyQuote
Posted : June 28, 2019 8:44 am
JVAshley
(@jvashley)
Silver Member
Posts: 262

It's not so much a trajectory as a spatter pattern, if we're being honest.

wotf019 Love that peony!

Count me in for Q3.
A WHOLE day early, I might add!

ReplyQuote
Posted : June 29, 2019 9:46 am
LDWriter2
(@ldwriter2)
Gold Star Member
Posts: 1263

So I am entered. Hmmm...

Working on turning Lead into Gold.
Four HMs From WotF
The latest was Q1'12
HM-quarter 4 Volume 32
One HM for another contest
published in Strange New Worlds Ten.
Another HM http://onthepremises.com/minis/mini_18.html

ReplyQuote
Posted : June 29, 2019 12:04 pm
Wulf Moon
(@wulfmoon)
Platinum Plus Member Moderator
Posts: 2277

Congrats to those that have their Q3s in!

Tick, tock, tick, tock, the ship is about to leave the dock!

Get 'em in before midnight tomorrow. You can do a lot with a day and a half. You can win this contest with a day and a half. wotf001

Fortune favor the brave...and the industrious!

~Moon~

JOIN THE WULF PACK! http://the super secrets.com
"Super-Duper Moongirl and the Amazing Moon Dawdler" wins WRITERS OF THE FUTURE VOL. 35 & BEST SF&F STORY OF 2019. Order WotF Volume 35 HERE!
“Muzik Man" in Deep Magic Fall 2020 wins BEST SF&F STORY of 2020
NEW! Don't miss the Super Secret "Character Agency: I Need a Hero!" in DreamForge Anvil Magazine!
JUST RELEASED! BEST OF DEEP MAGIC ANTHOLOGY TWO! Three Super Secrets Workshop members made it into this best of the best anthology! KD Julicher, Brittany Rainsdon, and some guy named Wulf Moon. Click HERE to get yours!
NEXT MASTER CLASSES AT FYRECON ONLINE, NOV. 18-21ST. Click HERE before they are sold out once again!

ReplyQuote
Posted : June 29, 2019 12:16 pm
tkunit
(@tkunit)
Advanced Member
Posts: 25

Going to sleep on mine tonight and read it through one more time before sending it off tomorrow.

Congratulations to all those that submitted; the hardest part is done.

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Posted : June 29, 2019 1:24 pm
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